Crisis of faith - Page 7 - Religion, God, and Theology

Well SGT RJ, it seems you feel you have had your questions answered, but if I may address the following:

There are many Christians who do not believe in literal interpretation.

Many would argue that there is nothing sinful about conception or birth, but human nature is imperfect and therefore sin is inevitable as a consequence of living our lives.

What is hell, other than the absence of salvation? If you die with fears and doubts, if you die without reconciliation to those you have hurt in life, and those who have hurt you, how could you ever rest in peace? How could your soul ever abide like that in Heaven?

To accept Jesus Christ is to accept the Word of God--the word that teaches us how to love each other, and how to forgive each other, and how to reconcile with each other.

Without God's divine and physical intervention, we would never find salvation. We would condemn ourselves. One cannot pretend to judge other people and other religions, or deny the possibility that God may manifest Himself in other ways, but I do believe that Christianity and the acceptance of Christ presents a way, if not the way, to salvation and peace.

Children are the closest of all to God. It is the ways of this world which corrupt us over time. Jesus even said that unless we change and become like children we cannot enter the Kingdom of God.

Faith is not about obeying or following regimens. Those are the ways of the Old Testament. Like a parent teaching their children who grow up and become of age, The Word of God was given to humanity so that we may learn the spirit of the law, not just the letter of the law. We must learn things for ourselves and develop a personal relationship with God, and only in that manner will we begin to understand His ways.

Who is to say we are punished? If you mean that we are punished for our sins and condemned to hell, then again I would argue that we condemn ourselves. Jesus offers salvation, should we choose to accept it.

But if you mean that we are punished by life, then I cannot give you the answer you seek, and most likely neither can anyone else. There are many mysteries to this world and our existence that we do not yet understand. God will reveal them to us in due time, when He thinks we are ready.

Speaking of which...

Many of us Christians do not take the Bible literally at all times. The science of evolution is quite clear, and I believe--as a Christian-- that God created the Universe as we know it 13.8 billion years ago, and He created the Earth 6 billion years ago, and man evolved and continued to evolve over millions and now tens of thousands of years.

Of course evolution was not a concept understood by ancient peoples, and God reveals the mysteries of the universe He created to us when He decides. Does anyone think the children of Israel were ready to understand things like chromosomes and natural selection 4,000 years ago? Or what about the Christians of medieval times? No, but He did reveal to them an allegory that represents figurative truth if not literal truth--something they could indeed understand.

Likewise, I would consider the concept of original sin figurative and not literal. We, as humans, evolved from our ancestors, are destined to be imperfect as we live our lives.

I don't think God condemns us; I think we condemn ourselves, and it is God's salvation which saves us in the end.

I'm sorry I didn't answer all of your questions, but maybe this little bit will help you or someone else. The example of Peter, the rock of the Church upon which the Word of God was built, shows us that doubt and hesitance are a natural part of learning, and over time becoming stronger in our faith.

When reading the Bible how do you decide what is allegorical and what is not? Do you believe the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, that God razed the two cities by raining sulfur upon them? I ask because Jesus makes reference to it.

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10-30-2016 , 09:05 PM

#152

isplashcranberrys

old hand

Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 1,390

I listened to this the other day and it really made me think. There is also a Q&A on another video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6aDoOzYN-U

I highly recommend watching it.

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10-31-2016 , 05:38 PM

#153

DeuceKicker

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 5,359

Yeah, it made me think Zacharias is a decent speaker, but there's nothing to his arguments. "I can't be an atheist because if I was I wouldn't be able to identify absolute morals, absolute meaning in life, or have absolute hope... Oh, and atheist = Hitler..."

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11-20-2016 , 11:29 PM

#154

Louis Cyphre

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 11,025

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shuffle

On the other hand, other supernatural events like the parting of the Red Sea, as far as my faith is concerned, should be understood to be literal.

Why? There is zero evidence anything resembling the events of Exodus ever happened. This has been acknowledged by Jewish scholars although it is even more essential to Judaism than it is to Christianity.

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11-21-2016 , 07:15 PM

#155

Louis Cyphre

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 11,025

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shuffle

First I would start with my belief that the dual nature of Christianity requires some stories in the Bible must exist only in the abstract, while other stories must be literal.
Are you referring to the dual nature (god/human) of Jesus?

If you start with an unfounded belief/premise any conclusions you draw are equally unfounded/flawed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shuffle

Which examples can we look at then as suitable candidates for literal interpretation?
As opposed to other examples, The Exodus is a strikingly inspirational story that involved God interceding on behalf of mankind, not against it. That is entirely compatible with my Christian understanding of the nature of God. It was such a singular event with no parallel in the annals of storytelling, that it hardly seems possible that the Hebrews were even intellectually capable of fabricating the story out of their own minds.

Argument from Incredulity/Lack of Imagination

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shuffle

Second, I would say that there doesn't need to be evidence for any matter of faith, as long as there is no conclusive evidence against it. The creation story in the Bible can be refuted with known science, and understood to be an allegory meant for simpler people to understand, but the Exodus does not fall into that category. There is neither evidence conclusively supporting it nor conclusively disproving it--which makes it a matter of faith, and subject to the interpretation of how one sees the world.

If you decide to believe whatever others can't disprove there isn't really much of a discussion to be had.

Anyway, while it is often stated that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence this is hardly an absolute rule. I do not have evidence that no tank drove through my front yard in the past five minutes but the lack of tracks is pretty good evidence that none did.
The same way you expect a tank to leave tracks you can expect a large number of people migrating to leave tracks along the way. You also expect a drastic population surge once these people reach there destination. Again no evidence anything like this ever happened.
This is if we accept that there even was an enslaved Hebrew population in Egypt in the first place.

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11-21-2016 , 07:48 PM

#156

Louis Cyphre

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 11,025

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shuffle

You'll have to explain whether you mean Christianity is unfounded, or a certain dogma within Christianity might be unfounded. If it's the former, you'll have to forgive me for dismissing your position out of hand in the same manner you did mine.

Christianity is unfounded in the sense that there is insufficient reason to believe it is true.

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