Look at the world we live in. 99% of people live in misery, poor, work a job they do not want to do for a very low salary. 1 % of people live the good live.

Looking at myself and nobody else, can I really say God exists and is Good in the same sentence. Well errr, lol for that one. The problem is more likely that a God does not exist. If he existed at least all good people would be living the good life.

Right now though that is clearly not the case!

You can really only come to two conclusions.

If you break it down logically.

Either God exists and he is Evil. Or
God does not exist.

I say this because he clearly lets the "innocent" suffer while pigs errr I mean bad people get away with lots of stuff and live the good life.

Another fact one might one to take into consideration. I have so many.

Lets look at medicine and pain.

Why does it take decades, even centuries for us to figure out how to cure certain illnesses?

It takes us that long because we are evolving and to find cures it takes time, trial and error.

Now let me ask you a simple question, if God existed wouldn't he A. Either not have disease at all or B. Not let us die and suffer from all kind of deceases and just simple provide the medicine instantly?

Anyway I am off to go play online rig poker, I know it is rigged because the pigs that are in control right now have rigged it for me to lose. Sounds pathetic but it's true.

yes, but if someone points out a contradiction in a movie I don't go out of my way to justify the contradiction. They are to be expected.

That's a very simple statement, do you have any proof for this? Other than "You are here on Earth so you must be guilty".

If in a shop and I am one of the employees then I would know if I was a co-conspirator or not. Again I ask for some proof of your claim!


Do you have any proof of this?

On another note: This God you are describing sounds a little like a tyrant, would you agree.

You are saying that if we do not abide and see him as our ruler/ lawgiver then he punishes us. Sounds like something Satan would do.


His Universe? Can you explain this to me.
Firstly why is it his Universe?
Secondly why does he have more of a right to this Universe then say you or I?

Thirdly the way you have just described God is that of a child who has a ball and refuses to let another child play with it.

That is why I think this whole story etc is childish?

If people followed God's laws, they'd have their own plot of land to grow their own food and wouldn't need jobs.

Numbers 33:54 And ye shall divide the land by lot for an inheritance among your families: and to the more ye shall give the more inheritance, and to the fewer ye shall give the less inheritance: every man's inheritance shall be in the place where his lot falleth; according to the tribes of your fathers ye shall inherit.


People apparently prefer man's laws, and hence the nightmare.

Isaiah 42:24 Who gave Jacob for a spoil, and Israel to the robbers? did not the LORD, he against whom we have sinned? for they would not walk in his ways, neither were they obedient unto his law.

I would think it somewhat depends on the contradiction and the impact that such a contradiction has on the overall story. Wouldn't you agree?

Also, there's probably some question of what it means to "go out of your way" in this case.

Do you think everyone running around doing whatever they want is going to produce a nice civil society?

It's this kind of insanity that got you thrown out of heaven.

Don't you think the creator of the Universe is in a much better position to make it's laws than you or anyone else is?

All this "playing with it" has resulted in the poor condition you currently find yourself in. You're just not that good of a ball player.

And with such fine contributions as this, you're fitting right in!

No of course not, but that is what is happening right now and God does nothing. So he does not exist according to yourself.

So apparently you at one point was thinking along similar lines too. That is why you got thrown out. Wait a minute, why do you not explain why you yourself got thrown out!

Firstly he would need to prove that he is indeed the creator of the Universe. Secondly no I do not think that.

Even though according to yourself he created the universe does not mean that somebody else could of A. Done a better job or B. Tell him how to do a better job.

I was also not talking about laws but why you thought he has more of a right to this Universe over you or I or anybody else.



That's all very easy to state, given that I fall in the 99% category just like most people do.

What do you tell the other 1% that have also been punished and sent to Earth yet live a really good life?

You think questioning things and stating your opinion is insanity. I really do not know what to say I am baffled by your stupidity and close mindedness.

According to yourself spirits have their own home in heaven.
It is not really their home but it is Gods.

Because spirits refuse to see God as their Boss and lawmaker.
He punishes them and kicks them out of their home, which was not really their home.

So to sum up.

Take close look at the sentence below: Is that true?

God lied to the spirits that they have a home called heaven. When God did not get his way and be the supreme lawmaker and big bully boss, he kicks everyone out of his home and punishes them.

Seems like a really cool dude, if you ask me. HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHA HAHA.............Some more HAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

You would of thought that if you had a real home, you wouldn't of been able to get kicked out of that home.

So you acknowledge that everyone doing whatever they want doesn't work. What alternative do you suggest?

When I said "everyone on Earth", that included me.

God doesn't really need to prove anything to anyone. You're here in hell, not him.

Perhaps, but he still is the mightiest being. I suspect He's the smartest and most well intentioned as well.

Because he created it and everything in it. And ultimately He's the Allmighty, so even if one were to argue might = right, he wins there as well.

Their game's almost over.

If your livelihood is contingent upon secular legislation in the United Kingdom or one of it's jurisdictional provinces, then yes, you should be disturbed as it has no legal grounding.

Yes, I do acknowledge that things aren't going the way they should be. The real problem lies with people that have real power. People that run countries, politicians, police, people with a lot of money etc. A lot of these pigs are corrupt and just pure filth.

Alternative: I like the idea that people can't just do whatever they feel like to whomever they like. The justice system does not work very well, that's a completely different topic altogether though.

I like the concept of God, it might of been better if all humans knew for certainty that heaven existed, we'd have something to live for and act accordingly.

The real problem though is that people still act on urges and still break the law. Most likely they know they will be punished or sent to jail, yet they still commit crimes. The real problem lies here in that innocent people are on the receiving end of those crimes. The justice system, even God in this case does not seem to prevent crimes. We need a system were crimes are prevented or simply not in our system to act upon.
So, do you know what you did wrong to piss God of? I for the life of me can't remember what I did wrong. I think it has to be pretty severe though, to be removed from heaven and sent to hell which is the worse place possible.
I do not agree with this.
Care to explain what you mean by this? I have heard this before, years ago, probably over a decade ago. I have yet to see any difference, in fact things have gotten a lot worse.

Nah im worried about where fringe ideas like like that have and could lead.

Hopefully a new government and me with my rightful land lot.

To address the Old and New Covenants with regards to their compatibility:

It appears to me that the people who want to make it out of here - be saved, are going to have to learn "the new song" according to the book of revelations.

Rev 5:9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

But what is this new song?

Rev 15:3 And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvelous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.


Apparently it's a harmonious synthesis of the song of Moses and the song of the lamb.

Not happening.

Matt. 21:21 Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.

That does carry a lot of wight with me. I stand corrected off with all the heads.

Let me just say that most of what is being talked about in this thread is being taken pretty out of context. I was a biblical studies major for my undergraduate studies so I may be able to chime in with some knowledge on these topics. If you are quoting a King James text you wasting everyone's time including yourself. I would recommend using NASB translation of bible or NIV at worst to get a better understanding of what the original authors were writing. The first step in getting a grasp on the Old Testament is to understand the world that the writers lived in at the time and how the stories and texts came to be recorded. The first step in understanding and interpreting the New Testament is to understand what it was like and what it meant to be a first century Jew at the time and the role the Old Testament played in the lives of Jews at the time. A lot of talk going on here and I welcome all questions/discussion will do my best to answer to best of my knowledge

Revelations is at its core a story of imagery and symbolism (more than any other book of the bible). I would have a hard time taking much of the text in a literal form as this was not its intention. A "New Song" is not a musical song like g sharp minor followed by b flat. Its using the term song in a symbolic imagery form. A new song is like a new rush of excitement or thankfulness. If you just got released from prison the writer may have said something like John had a new song of thankfulness in his heart. idk just being general

How do you feel right now, realizing how much precious lifetime you wasted?

I would say a "song" is like knowing something by heart.

To sing the song of Moses is knowing the law by heart.

The "song" of the lamb is much more complicated, but it would appear that Jesus was in constant communication with God, doing his will 24/7 - so effectively, this "song" is receiving precise instruction on a minute to minute basis, as did Jesus.

Matt. 21:21 Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.

And in this verse, the fig tree represents Judaism. The Jewish Publication Society uses a picture of a fig leaf as their emblem, for example.

The mountain represents the government composed of all this fraudulent man made legislation forming the Roman empire at that time and giant mess that is democracy at this time.

The sea represents restless, moving people who are not as oppressed and are free to move around.

It seems quite handy that you can just define words however you want them ( "eg song = knowing something by heart, not a definition I have ever heard before) in order to support what you are claiming.