if you think your opponents leading range is so mainly comprised of draws you should be raising the flop for value and doing the same with over pairs etc and not folding the top of your flop raising range.

The only hands in your defending range here should give your opponent reverse implied odds.

This argument is getting silly so this will be my last post on the topic.

I never said our opponent's leading range consists of only draws but even if it was we can't profitably value raise A high because 1) our opponent's equity with his draws are higher than ours, and 2) he will be able to bluff on a decent amount of turns or we will have to check back those turns because they improve his range too much. But we do like enough turns that calling flop vs. a lead is more profitable than folding.

If your opponents range does not primarily consist of draws how the **** can you profitably call three streets with ace high?!!! What's he leading with? Deuce six ?

Bet 2/3 on turn and give up most rivers because he's calling

On 8, K, J, 6, diamond rivers shove

Sorry newbie to this site question: what does TT9dd mean? Two of the cards were diamonds?

Yes.

the sizing of the 3b stands out to me from a solid player. is it standard for him to 3.3x it with his value range?

$90-$120 are all theoretically sound 3 bet sizings here

Is check raising all in on the flop terrible? We're a favorite over everything but big overpairs (and then only a slight dog). Can they call here? If so, we get to see two cards as a slight underdog. If AA or KK always calls because our play is so transparent, then maybe we should check raise all in occasionally when we do have the T?

I prefer cr flop vs anything else, but you really need to ssmallerour stack according to your future actions. Personally I don't think cr bet will get vill to fold on river so I think your options are to cr bigger to set up turn shove or smaller so river you can get value when hit and give up when you don't. Obviously you need a decent amount of fe to do this. I think c/stuffing flop Makes your hand look weak and will get way more calls then smaller raises.

for those that like leading, what sizing do you prefer, and what sizing would you use on brick runouts (2x, 3x etc)? what spr are you trying to get to the river with?

I think leading on the flop is about the worst thing we can do. The hands that we're the biggest favorite over -- AK and AQ -- are the ones we want to win additional money off of. Leading out just gives them a chance to fold. (As daniel9861 points out in an earlier reply). Check raising the flop is the best way to get some additional money from AK and AQ, and then fold them out before they get a chance to hit something on the turn. If AK hits a K on the turn, we're now significant dogs (68-32) but will feel compelled to see the river anyway.

And here's a further consideration (that leads me to like check raising all in on the flop). What if an obvious draw card that makes our hand hits on the turn? Now an overpair like KK MIGHT be able to get away from the hand precisely when we don't want him to. Given that a big overpair isn't going away on the flop no matter what we do, isn't it best to tie him to the end so that we get all his chips when we hit, get some money from AK and AQ before they fold, and don't have to worry about a tough turn decision when a blank hits?

As played, I would bet 750ish on turn, stuff most rivers. Would like to bet bigger on turn but need to conserve ammo for the river shove. I think check raising flop is fine, but effective stack might need to be 1K+ higher.

I like check call flop, check raise turn, and jam river line also.

10 10 9 with two diamonds

We're a big dog against any bigger flush draw, and villain can easily have a boat already too. Or trips. How are we just all ignoring this in a 250 bb situation?

Based on vills description I am not at all worried about being against a boat anything else we have solid equity against.

c/c the flop is the optimal line here IMO. C/Ring makes villains range super strong, and we aren't even sure if half our outs are good (other than our 2 outer supernuts). So reduced fold equity and reverse implied odds in deepstacked pot = bad.

I think c/ring causes us to polarize our range vs a strong range that includes tons of bluff catchers cuz our value range is so narrow (and unlikely to have many big overpairs cuz we flatted OOP). Hard to be balanced cbetting this flop, yet alone c/ring.

If villain bets into our flop c/c line, he effectively polarizes his range - while ours is still wide. Though it should be said that villain is betting 88,99, and JJ+ here because he can't check back with so many draws on the board in our range.

Based on the turn card I'd decide my next move. 5 kind of sucks. I think at that point i'm between b/fing the turn any K//6/J. Overplaying this hand this deep is just trouble.

As played:
I would want to x/f the turn unimproved as bluffing into such a strong range is spew with 5 turn. But with the extra equity we picked up almost any betsize other than villain overbetting forces us to x/c. Shoving any river K//6/J/8/4.

I think there is some merit to c/shoving any non-diamond 4 - villain might shove a ton of his range there because it is more subtle and doesn't match with the obvious draws. It just sucks when he bet/bet/checks back IP with something like 99/JJ.

c/r flop, as played now lead turn for $690 or $710 etc.

edit: After thinking, check/call flop, lead turn might be a bit cleaner actually. I would say c/raise vs. call is dependent on villain and largely his propensity to re-raise vs. fold flop vs. the c/r and also his likelihood of folding turn to a bet based on your action. Either is fine, the better choice imo is a product of the particular player.

double edit: c/call flop, c/raise turn is super messy regardless of the board from the flop on out. You're going to valuetown yourself when beat and sacrifice value when you're ahead.

frankly, as played it's so standard to just b/b/ after your flop c/r that whatever happens, happens. in today's game, it's just standard, and you hope that when you are called, and lose, he shows up with a hand that theoretically should never fold and vice versa for when you win with or without a showdown.


that said, i would pay someone to hash out whether or not c/r turn is better than b/b/.

3b 20% is a very very high 3b % and id be inclined to 4b way more often than id choose this hand to defend to a 3b oop
you can start building your 4b ranges which im guessing are unbalanced....and this is a decent candidate to have in your 4b bluff range
really not a fan of the flat pre at this price.
that said on this flop you have much more 10x than villain and 999 plays this way as well (but again if hes 3b 20% otb he has alot of 10x broadway combos here so not rly sure)
its such a draw heavy board thou that its gonna be prty ez for villain to put you on diamonds and call you down with a lot of his range here
kinda gross spot post flop

As played Bet turn shove river. Pray you make str8 or flush or you can make him fold his hand if you brick.

I don't like playing pots vs others that crush the game. Just make life easy and avoid oop tough sticky spots vs good players.

If you brick river do you really think a final bet will work that often?