gotta give my coach john ettinger aka soccermom5 props def not a scam he knows his **** and teaches it very well. Best money i ever spent

Never been coached by him, But there's a guy on PokerSavvy.com who makes videos and goes by the name AMA0330. He's a very intelligent guy, and explains exactly what he's thinking and why he's acting/reacting the way he does at the table. He'll make videos for micro stakes and ADMIT while he's playing that he's not a regular at the limits he's making the video at. But he will explain a lot of things in depth and really try and help you learn/improve your own game.

Maybe people who are hiring coaches should try and find one at the limits they play. Sounds obvious, but a lot of ppl see guys who play 400NL and want them to coach em, but the person themselves only play 25NL. It only makes sense to hire someone who plays/beats the stakes you're interested in.

NOTE: Some of the best NFL/NCAA coaches were not superstars in their sport but average pros that became excellent students of the game.

A coach in any endeavor can only take you so far it is up to the player to implement the new skill sets. If you don't have the self discipline to listen, observe, learn and implement then no amount of money or coaching will fix your life leaks much less poker. This type of player/person is exactly what a "Coach Predator/Con Man" is looking for as a mark.
The Training Sites could implement some of the following to protect players:
1. Internal poker software client so players can play under different names if they choose to protect their real money accounts. (remember PokerSchoolOnline?)
2. Coaches should have to disclose not only the account names they play under to their prospective students but the IP addresses as well.
3. The sites should screen students better. Simply asking what are some of your poker goals? They could then recommend appropriate coaches.
4. "Students / Coaches should be forbidden from conducting any of site monetary transactions at all whatsoever" In bold on every page and in the terms of service.

gotta disagree with OP. a lot of things go into a long-term winning poker player. good strategy and sound poker tactics are a small piece of what you need, and this is what coaches are for. coaches cannot teach you emotional control nor do they claim to possess it themselves... they are offering the X's and O's about poker strategy. to say someone is a losing player therefore they must have bad tactics, is a false statement.


http://www.anskypoker.com/2009/05/3-...eed-to-master/

an article in gugels blog that scratches the tip of the iceberg about this point.

what about micro/ssnl glorified cardrunners hero: Veerner?

He himself is pushing losing player [vital]myth (makes 1 vid a week for cardrunners)

He recommended him for coaching in his blog which has about 1mil followers looking for coaches because they cant be 2nl

That guy is diagonals on PTR

and anyone who's watched his vids or played with him agree on his losing winrate.

It wasnt the first time a glorified poker hero has pushed terrible coaches.

Just thought that should be outed because its outrageous

Also Soccermom5 is a guy who is pushed a lot on these forums for coaching because he has... a 5ptbb winrate on PTR

Well he has 300k hand on 2 years and he plays short sessions of 5mins because he leaves as soon as the fish sitouts, plus a ton of CAP (only fish under highstakes)

So winrate isnt all of it, you have to find someone who isnt a bumhunting weak player

How about we start a Professional Poker Coach certification and coaches can provide their stats and can be verified and if cleared get a stamp of approval.

My personal opinion on the subject is that if your coaching is so good, then you would be happy to stake the student and take a % of winnings for the coaching. That way your putting your money where your mouth is and the student knows you have his/her best interest. Not pay me $500 an hour and glgl.

This is how we vetted coaches before all the scandals on the other sites have come to light. We are discussing how to take this to a higher level.

A coach is only there to coach. He can't make you play/think/act like he does. So I don't think that having them stake you is going make things right. I know some coaches/stakers are doing this now, but they don't just pick any person, they watch them play several sessions and then determine whether or not that individual has the potential or not.

I kind of like the idea of paying a coach based on your winnings since you began studying under him. But again, there's pro's and con's to this idea.

This. Even if you end up paying 1000x more in profit sharing, it's a hell of a lot more profitable than losing. I also assume you don't make a lifelong profit sharing deal so it does have some finite time frame. On top of that, it sounds like a good lawyer commercial They don't get paid until you get paid and that way all the incentives are well aligned on both ends.

I'd rather pay nanonoko 500k of my first million than pay some famous guy 1000hr and then keep breaking even if it meant I knew how to make a million $ after working with nano. Obviously that is extreme, but I also don't think he could teach me that overnight.

guess i succeeded in not spewing away secrets, fees wins again

Nah best coaching deal is to make milestones per limits

Coaches who do this are usualy the only legits one outside of the massive sick good coaches.

No limits to hours of coaching, (skype, live or msn)

-50% up till 6000$ total profit
-40% 6000 - 14000$
-30% 14000 - 23000$
-20% 23000 - 35000$
-10% 35000$ untill coaching is finished.

that means the more you make the more the coach makes but the less % you give. Everybody wins.
He will make you move up faster, and you wont be counting your dimes on hourly

This is usualy good with a stake at 100-200nl for players who have potential to move up to 5/10

I think that as the poker training industry matures it will become more transparent. Its really important for members to know who they are learning from and that there is independent third party verification of coaches' earnings. While the tracking sites do not get absolutely every hand, they are better now then when they started, and most people agree that they track their results fairly accurately. But the fact is that these sites are good tools for researching coaches, and they are all we've got in terms of verification. Its no longer enough to rely on someone's word or their own HEM graph, its too easy to doctor a graph or a results page by purging hands. Its also fairly easy for a coach to misrepresent himself like Jason Ho did because of the knowledge gap between top coaches and small stakes players.

On our coaches page at DragTheBar, we link the PTR graph for every cash game coach, the goal is simply to be up front about what our coaches have done at the tables so members and potential members have as much information as they can get about who they are learning from. So whether or not everyone likes PTR, its a very useful tool when it comes to helping students find reliable coaches that are worth their money. The better the 3rd party verification, the better off the student is. Ultimately the student has to decide how to spend his money, and obviously doing the research on who's beating your relevant game is critical, not simply relying on the prevailing wisdom for who to go to.

Anyway, thats my 2 cents on the issue.

good post sir.

[QUOTE=Pokerdemic;16878683]you have a point