Can't believe he has written that he has an extensive background in Game Theory and still he advocates mini raising for info.. Jason Ho must be so fooled by randomness.

It seems to me from the time-line Jim is saying that their official/standard QA procedures were not implemented until "late 2008" after Jason had already been made a coach.

People are giving them kudos because they are owning up for not vetting him not only because they should do so for all their coaches but especially because he was an unsolicited coach and not referred by anyone.

Great Job Stox! Very professional in handling this.

RvtSteve, I am not going to debate whether or not Stox Quality Control or vetting process came into effect before or after this whole fiasco. They had an opportunity to go above and beyond and not only keep their reputation intact, but to enhance it to the "Holy crap what an awesome company" level. They chose to take a hit to their reputation IMO.

I think they did the awesome thing!

The other stuff is to far away from stoxpoker and can't be done in a reasonable way imo.

Fair enough resolution from Stox imo.

excellent Jim. Huge respect.

You just turned into a street with a dead end sir. I know your first impulse is to shoot your way out of this, but the best option is to drop to your knees and put your hands behind your head. You do not stand a chance. Nice try though!

I would disagree. And so would the vast majority, it seems.

+1

A fool and his money are soon parted, evident in this thread. I can just imagine these stary-eyed morans with hopes of making easy internet pokers moneys like durrr and getting totally duped by the ****head Jason Ho. Jason Ho might have won in the short term, but for someone seemingly intelligent to scam lesser intelligent people, one would think he would have the wisdom to have the foresight that this will come back to him and cause more problems than it was worth. If I was ever stupid enough to get scammed by a similarly ridiculous scam, I would kill Jason Ho if I ever met him on the street somewhere. That's right, Jason Ho would probably get thai clinched, kneed, mounted, and Ezekiel choked until he stopped living. Jason Ho, you sir are actually worse than the morans that you scammed, because you made a more severe intellectual blunder. YOU GOT CAUGHT.

You are a very bad man Jason Ho.
You are a very bad man Jason Ho.
You are a very bad man Jason Ho.
You are a very bad man Jason Ho.
You are a very bad man Jason Ho.
You are a very bad man Jason Ho.
You are a very bad man Jason Ho.
You are a very bad man Jason Ho.

Bronx,

If you were in Stoxpoker's position, what would you have done differently to enhance the company's level past what it is now, after admitting their mistakes?

They are estimating a cost of $100,000 that is directly tied to the mistakes they made in not checking Jason's background. They will not, however, pay for the mistakes that were made without their knowledge.

Would you expect to get reimbursed by a video training site if an investment or staking deal went wrong if the site was not involved in any way, shape or form?

I'm trying to understand the logic behind your posts.

Absolutely amazing thread, thanks all, if I ever win/play those stakes I will be doing the coaching, not buying it!!

Good response by stox.

why is this thread not the most popular search result for "jason ho poker?"

it sucks that his crummy website and his blog are still top 3.

how can we change that?!

I'd like some clarification on this from Stox or one of the affected students. Were the majority of or even all payments made by students to Jason large lump-sums rather than lesson by lesson? It seems this is the case both from reading the accusations earlier in the thread and the $100k figure.

If this is correct, Stox' response seems fair and more than I expected. There's a big difference between refunding the first two large packages and half of a third and refunding the first two lessons and half of a third. It could reasonably take a few lessons for a student to realize the coach sucks and is a scam artist, especially given the status Jason was given by Stox. But if we're talking about giving a full refund up until the time a student who had already made two large purchases was satisfied/conned enough to make a third, that seems a quite reasonable point at which to say buyer beware.

First off, I'd like to commend Jim, and all others involved, on how they handled this rather difficult situation. I can honestly say that I've never been more proud to be employed by Stox/CR.

Now, to expound on something Jim said...

The Stox Brand Manager, Alex Huang, and myself are in the process of setting up a new coaching forum. It will be put together in the spirit of our current system at CardRunners, which has been in place since October of 2008. Over that time we have booked over 800 lessons for a total value of nearly $300,000, all with nary a problem (only one refund has ever been issued due to an unsatisfactory experience).

It will be a safer more regulated method of booking lessons with a coach than what we have currently, and is designed 100% with the member's security and quality of experience in mind.

While we don't have a firm time frame for getting this up, I suspect you should see something concrete in the next week or two.

Regards,
Jeff Miller

My bad, I didn't know that the 10 posters who agree costitutes a "Vast Majority", LOL.

I was merely pointing out a flaw in the logic of your previous comment. You stated that Stox was admitting they had a vetting procedure that Jason Ho was not subjected to. I merely pointed out that judging by the time-line it seems the QA standards they implemented and currently use came after Jason Ho was already a part of the team.

I can't argue when the QA process began. I can only go by what Jim posted.

I'm not sure I even follow what you mean by Stox having an opportunity to go above and beyond. Do you mean they could/should reimburse everyone who's ever come in contact with Jason Ho through Stox? That's a slippery slope.

I think Stox has taken a hit to their reputation and are handling it by 1)admitting it; 2)offering restitution in a way they deem reasonable and fair; 3)assuring the community they have procedures in place to make sure it won't happen again. All in a timely and professional manner.

I don't think you ask for much more from a company facing an issue like this.

I would have refunded all fees collected by Jason for Coaching. I further would have made good any losses suffered by his students. That's just me.

These coaching sites are selling training, but they are also selling trust too. Stox broke that trust when they allowed Jason Ho to become Coach on their site. If they had done their job and dilligently and conducted a basic backround check on the guy, none of this would have happened.

And I also disagree with your premise that Stox wasn't involved in this in any way. They gave Jason Ho a tacit seal of approval by having him as an instructor/coach. If he was never hired, none of this would ever have happened.

Hi all - very busy weekend for me, once I have a free moment I will be back to help finalize details discussed by Jim.

I havent been back to answer questions because I've been busy working on other details as well as helping Jim behind the scenes when it is possible, I havent been intentionally avoiding the thread, I just ran out of free time - too much work to do. I will be back to read the last two pages of posts tomorrow, sorry I am so far behind :-(

What about money the students lost playing poker? Should they be reimbursed for that? What about anyone who ever watched a Jason Ho training video and then lost money playing poker? What if the plane to Macau crashed, would Stox be culpable for the lives of Jason Ho's students who would never have been on that plane if he was never hired?

Allow me to clarify. By losses I mean any money Jason scammed these guys out of.

"Jason Ho, you sir are actually worse than the morans that you scammed, because you made a more severe intellectual blunder. YOU GOT CAUGHT."

Outside of taking a few hits to his "rep" though, he got away with it! Despite your weird ranting, n one is going to physically harm him.

Every poster except you has said they handled it well. You are entitled to you opinion of course - it's just quite obviously a minority one.

So is Jason Ho paying the 40% he "borrowed" from the staking fund?

I think this is completely (and very obviously) unrealistic.

For sure StoxPoker gave this character a golden opportunity to scam.

StoxPoker's selection, retention, and endorsement of Jason Ho gave him the ideal platform to contact his victims.

The rest was a private matter.

If I was one of these guys I'd at least be contemplating a Camp Macau part II (This time its personal). Maybe the Stox re-embursement could cover the airfare.